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From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Fri, 12.02.21 20:50
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 12 Feb 21 14:50:41, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

O> Calling someone a troll is your definition of being polite?

You are a troll who (A) Started random shit with me quite some time ago
because "you can" and (B) Tries to take me to task technically but can't.

So you invent things to whine about, like this:

O> (question). Why is the FTSC unable to publish an FTS for the packet format(s
O> in use for decades? I start to believe that some members of the FTSC don't
O> even understand the difference between FTS-0001 F.1. and what's in use today

If you believe the FTSC does not live up to your expectations, then do
something about it and get involved instead of running your mouth. Nobody is
stopping you. Kindof like what you were told recently by the Husky guys.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Fri, 12.02.21 21:08
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 12 Feb 21 18:59:00, Alexey Vissarionov said the following to Richard
Menedet

AV> HR>> So I like to nominate:
AV> HR>> Richard Menedetter 2:310/31
AV> RM> I accept.
AV>
AV> You and Maurice seem to be the only "T" people in the coming FTSC... :-/

The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: Rob Swindell (1:103/705)
To: All
Date: Fri, 12.02.21 19:34
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Alexey Vissarionov on Fri Feb 12 2021 08:08 pm

> The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?

Just so long as the web-site is kept up, I don't see much difference.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Fri, 12.02.21 22:50
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 12 Feb 21 18:34:17, Rob Swindell said the following to Nick Andre:

> The FTSC could always be disbanded if it cannot serve its purpose?
RS>
RS> Just so long as the web-site is kept up, I don't see much difference.

Me neither.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: mark lewis (1:3634/12)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 07:46
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to Wilfred van Velzen on Fri Feb 12 2021 16:28:07


RS> Multiple drafts were rejected for reasons the author didn't agree
RS> with (e.g. draft spec had to be submitted by splitting the text
RS> among multiple echomail messages, per stone-age FTSC submission
RS> requirements). So he gave up the effort and the FTSC discarded a
RS> rare high-quality technical contribution. Or at least, that's my
RS> recollection.

i forget the details but the document is on the FTSC table as FSP-1042 since
2019 Mar 26... the previous FSP number was recycled to the SRIF document when
the FTSC chairperson at that time decided to no longer reserve document
numbers... there is a different chairperson, now... not sure if they are
reserving document numbers or not, though...

the presented document has gone through a few edits to correct a few things...
one was a table fix and the other was to fix a copy pasta error... aside from
that, diff showed minor formatting changes shortening line widths...
at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr 11...


)\/(ark
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* Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)

From: Rob Swindell (1:103/705)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 12:54
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 06:46 am

> at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr
> 11...

Can't find it on ftsc.org.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

From: mark lewis (1:3634/12)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 17:07
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21


ml>> at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019 Apr
11...

RS> Can't find it on ftsc.org.

correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same
process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
* Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)

From: Rob Swindell (1:103/705)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 15:14
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 04:07 pm

> Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
> By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21
>
>
> ml>> at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019
> Apr 11...
>
> RS> Can't find it on ftsc.org.
>
> correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same
> process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...

I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a
non-public forum?
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

From: Carol Shenkenberger (1:275/100)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 18:25
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Dan Clough to Oli on Fri Feb 12 2021 01:24 pm

> -=> Oli wrote to Dan Clough <=-
>
> DC> Because "Oli" is an asshole. That's what he does.
>
> Ol> Can someone please nominate Dan "Exploding Heads" Clough? I think
> Ol> he is highly qualified for the job.
>
> Exploding heads? Not sure what you mean by that, but whatever.
>
> Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?
>
>
> ... Ignorance can be cured. Stupid is forever.
> === MultiMail/Linux v0.52

Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

From: mark lewis (1:3634/12)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 18:43
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 14:14:40


ml>> correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same
process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration...

RS> I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in
a non-public forum?

all documents, when selected by the FTSC, go through a similar process as was
done originally with this document... at that time, there is no public feedback
on the document... only the FTSC members are involved in that stage
of proofreading, analysis, refining, and modifying the document before it is
approved or turned back for more refinement based on provided feedback... yes,
it is kinda like double work on the same task... the initial work
being done by the originator and the next level being done by the FTSC members
who elect to participate in the process...

in any case, when the previous work in this echo went silent, some FTSC members
worked together to bring the last public version into the private FTSC area for
further discussion, refinement, and eventual approval or denial...
they did not want to see the work that went into the document wasted... i was
one of those... i'll let others speak up for themselves if they want it known
of their participation and backing...

hopefully once this current (s)election process is over, the FTSC will return
to the document and complete the process...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
* Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)

From: Rob Swindell (1:103/705)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 16:00
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 05:43 pm

> RS> I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed
> RS> in a non-public forum?
>
> all documents, when selected by the FTSC, go through a similar process as
> was done originally with this document... at that time, there is no public
> feedback on the document... only the FTSC members are involved in that stage
> of proofreading, analysis, refining, and modifying the document before it is
> approved or turned back for more refinement based on provided feedback...
> yes, it is kinda like double work on the same task... the initial work
> being done by the originator and the next level being done by the FTSC
> members who elect to participate in the process...

I found a flaw in the document a while back, I don't remember the specifics
now, but if I can't review the current draft, how am I supposed to know if the
flaw has been addressed or not?
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

From: Carol Shenkenberger (1:275/100)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 18:43
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 02:14 pm

> Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
> By: mark lewis to Rob Swindell on Sat Feb 13 2021 04:07 pm
>
> > Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
> > By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 11:54:21
> >
> >
> > ml>> at this time, the present document is "FSP-1042 Draft 6" as of 2019
> > Apr 11...
> >
> > RS> Can't find it on ftsc.org.
> >
> > correct... it has not been published, yet... it is going through the same
> > process as all other documents that have been presented for consideration
>
> I'm confused though: it was a public proposal, but it's being processed in a
> non-public forum?

I'm confused too. Lets see if Andrew can find it. I do not recall it being
sent in nor do I have archives back to 2019.

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

From: mark lewis (1:3634/12)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 19:10
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Rob Swindell to mark lewis on Sat Feb 13 2021 15:00:17


RS> I found a flaw in the document a while back, I don't remember the
specifics now, but if I can't review the current draft, how am I supposed to
know if the flaw has been addressed or not?

well, you wouldn't know... hopefully it was found but it is possible it has not
yet been discovered... the document is still on the desk... i can't really say
more and may have already said too much... i've not yet been
reprimanded by any other FTSC members but i'm going to hold off posting more...


)\/(ark
--- SBBSecho 3.11-Linux
* Origin: SouthEast Star Mail HUB - SESTAR (1:3634/12)

From: Dan Clough (1:123/115)
To: All
Date: Sat, 13.02.21 20:42
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
-=> Carol Shenkenberger wrote to Dan Clough <=-

> Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?

CS> Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is
"obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?



... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Sun, 14.02.21 09:15
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 14 Feb 21 11:09:05, Tom De Puysseleyr said the following to Andrew Leary:

TD> AL> The following members' terms expire on 11 Mar 2021:
TD> AL> Nick Andre 1:229/426
TD>
TD> I hereby nominate Nick Andre.

I accept.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: Dan Clough (1:123/115)
To: All
Date: Sun, 14.02.21 09:01
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
-=> Andrew Leary wrote to Dan Clough <=-

CS>> Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.

DC> OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is
DC> "obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?

AL> That is not correct.

Well, effectively speaking, it is. The evidence is right before us.

DC> Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?

AL> I, as the FTSC Administrator, am the moderator of this echo.
AL> Unfortunately, for the reasons posted earlier by Nick Andre, it
AL> is difficult to enforce echo rules, and even more difficult or
AL> impossible to cut the feed to a repeated offender.

I understand that. Have you, as the moderator, told this offender,
either publicly or privately, that he is violating the rules? While it
is certainly *difficult* to enforce the rules, that's not the same thing
as *not* *even* *trying* to enforce the rules.

At least make the token effort? It's a process.



... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
=== MultiMail/Linux v0.52
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Palantir * palantirbbs.ddns.net * Pensacola, FL * (1:123/115)

From: Carol Shenkenberger (1:275/100)
To: All
Date: Sun, 14.02.21 16:45
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Dan Clough to Carol Shenkenberger on Sat Feb 13 2021 07:42 pm

> -=> Carol Shenkenberger wrote to Dan Clough <=-
>
> > Are real names required in this Fidonet echo?
>
> CS> Yes, real names. Oli is just being obstinant.
>
> OK, thanks for that. So, real names are required, unless one is
> "obstinant"? Then they don't have to follow the rules? Is that it?
>
> Who's the moderator, and (again), why is this allowed to continue?
>
>
>
> ... So easy, a child could do it. Child sold separately.
> === MultiMail/Linux v0.52

I suspect by defaulr it is Andrew Leary?

I don't mind Oli too much but it's obviously a handle. Impression is if you
havent the honesty tp post with a real name, 'why should we listen'?

xxcarol
--- SBBSecho 2.11-Win32
* Origin: SHENK'S EXPRESS telnet://shenks.synchro.net (1:275/100)

From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Mon, 15.02.21 09:16
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 15 Feb 21 11:43:02, Oli said the following to Nick Andre:

O> If you think this is all motivated by an urge to troll people, you really
O> should check your definition of trolling. But I doubt you care. You're
O> throwing shit at the wall until something sticks.

Anyone who feels the urge to reply with two long messages of effeminate quoted
nonsense has a serious mental problem.

End of thread, Bono.

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: Nick Andre (1:229/426)
To: All
Date: Mon, 15.02.21 16:11
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
On 15 Feb 21 12:00:15, Rob Swindell said the following to Oli:

RS> I'm not sure I fixed anything as Nick never provided any test reports. <shr

I haven't had the time yet. I'm sure its fine.

I did email you about an aspect of the Zmodem spec, did you get that?

Nick

--- Renegade vY2Ka2
* Origin: Joey, do you like movies about gladiators? (1:229/426)

From: Rob Swindell (1:103/705)
To: All
Date: Mon, 15.02.21 13:36
Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
Re: Re: 2021 FTSC Standing Member Election -
By: Nick Andre to Rob Swindell on Mon Feb 15 2021 03:11 pm

> On 15 Feb 21 12:00:15, Rob Swindell said the following to Oli:
>
> RS> I'm not sure I fixed anything as Nick never provided any test reports.
> RS> <shr
>
> I haven't had the time yet. I'm sure its fine.
>
> I did email you about an aspect of the Zmodem spec, did you get that?

I didn't see it cause it inexplicably ended up in my junk folder. I'll reply
now.
--- SBBSecho 3.12-Linux
* Origin: Vertrauen - [vert/cvs/bbs].synchro.net (1:103/705)

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